Upgrading LEDs in my 4x4 tent

This topic doesn’t seem to have been discussed recently. I currently have MH TSW 2000 LED in my 4x4. That light has been a work horse and is ready to be replaced. Considering moving up to Mars Hydro’s FC series. Maybe something like the E6500 which steps up into the commercial category.

My question is if anybody has taken this step up and whether you have seen results that have made you a believer. Bottom line: For somebody who generally has a couple plants going and has been doing this for years, do you think I’d meaningfully improve the health of my plants? Or do you feel as though it’s just overkill and the TS series is plenty?

I note TS series is all Samsung. FC series is Bridgelux. Is this an item to take into consideration?

I did reach out to MH. They are responsive but the explanation (not recommendation) simply resorted to a physics conversation and went straight over my head.

Anybody out there who can translate and offer a well thought out opinion? Thanks!

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I’m a fan of a lot of light and typically run my PPFD at ~1,100, which is at the upper limit of what a plant can do well with without having to deal with the issues that come up with CO2. I run 3 HLG Rspec 135 panels above each plant during flowering to get there.

If you are a fan of light, you could probably use the HLG PPFD maps to figure out how to get there with other light models considering your grow space.

I recognize there are diminishing returns above ~900 PPFD, but I do it anyway. I get solid flowers doing it.

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The FC series from Mars is Samsung LM301B’s, not bridgelux. The FC-E series lights from Mars have the inferior quality LED’s.

Applied as large bar style LED grow lights for large-scale commercial cultivation and high-quality professional grows, Mars Hydro FC6500 employs Samsung LM301B diodes and a full spectrum light that is rich in red and blue, and adopts a uniform PPFD to maintain an even lighting spread and optimal PPF across the canopy.

  • Wattage - 730w±5%
  • Personal Cultivation Coverage - 5x5 ft
  • Commercial Cultivation Coverage - 4x4 ft

Based on your use of the word inferior, you’d opt for the Samsung over the FC-E series? Appreciate the input. Any feelings about the move up to the FC series from TS?

Most definitely on the Samsungs. And inferior does not mean bad, just not superior. Big difference in output and efficiency. As for the change from one to the other, I started with 2 TS1000’s and grew some nice bud. I have since moved to the HLG 350r and again what a difference over the Mars TS series. I have never used the FC series but I was looking at the same light you are looking at when I decided on the HLG.

Here are pics for example of what a really good light can do.
First pic is at 11 weeks using the TS1000


This pic is same age, 11 weeks with the 350r
Also the same strain and grow method.

Samsung for the win!!

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I think at the end of the day it comes down to what you’re looking for. If you want to maximize your grow space and fill it wall to wall, than the fc6500 is the better choice. Now if you’re growing 1-2 small plants and you’re happy with the yeild and quality, than the light you have is just fine. No sense in spending the extra money on electricity to light up the floor, not to mention the cost of the light itself.

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They may say this, but I have been through a couple commercial grows and seen hundreds of pictures from commercial grow lighting arrangements. I have not seen these used in such applications.

Mars is like Walmart brand of horticulture led applications. This doesn’t mean you can’t grow weed with them, but there is a reason lighting from bigger names usually cost more. They absolutely want you to feel like you’re getting a better light because they claim to use Samsung leds, but they’re not using the best leds that Samsung has to offer.

Making a comparison on Samsung vs Bridgelux is difficult too. Mars is proven to be one of the least trustworthy lighting companies out there, but their specs list fc6500 at 2.85 umol/joule and fce6500 at 2.8 umol/joule. That’s less than 2% difference in efficiency for over 20% difference in price. Samsung does kind of own this midpower chip category, but in other led tech bridgelux and others are better. So I wouldn’t fall into the group of just saying something is better just because it says Samsung. This without mention to the games Mars likes to play in the event something ever goes wrong with your light. Sure, they are cheaper than a lot of the lights others recommend. But if you run into issue with driver, a company like HLG is going to most likely overnight you a replacement driver the next business day. You most likely won’t have heard back from Mars yet, and when you do, they’ll want you to ship them your light. Hoping they’ll have it back to you within a few weeks.

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I grew in 1970’s-1980’s, rarely completing a grow successfully. When growing with 1000watts MH,girls loved the light. Currently using LED’s andBought HLG350R and love the LUX output. Greater output than 535 watts from the Vipar Spectra V1200, same distance with half the wattage (real watts/LUX measured).
Sucks, all my lights are shit, except the HLG. The china cheapies will grow clones, seedlings, veg nicely. The VS1200 and 350R almost fill the 4x4. The VS keeps the tent warm and runs the elec meter fast.


Upgrading my lights will come next fall. Disney this June.

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Hey forum, This is super helpful. Keep input coming.

I know every plant and every grow is different. Little things can make big differences, particularly with autos. So I was hoping somebody out there would tell me something like: You can expect, on average, a yield increase of about X% upgrading the lights. Nobody has done that in a way I can understand. But a picture is worth a thousand words.

Obviously, there’s a step between which would be the existing 2000 series in the tent and your 1000. But the difference you show is impressive.

Some of the guys on the forum are pointing to American made and recommending. So I’ve done a bit more digging. Really not too concerned over the price of the light since I’ve learned the hard way that you usually get what you pay for.

MH has given me fair service. I don’t mean a step up from poor. I mean I think I was treated fairly, albeit a bit drawn out. They’ve replaced drivers but also want videos and the process does take awhile. Guys have pointed to a couple other firms where they’ve talked about drivers being shipped overnight before MH has even cranked up the process. That’s more in line with the kind of service work I’ve seen from other firms in the industry.

I think I may just raise my price point a bit. Not because throwing money at a problem is the best solution. I just don’t want to sit here a year from now saying: you cheap bastard! For another hundred or two, you’d never be looking in the rearview mirror.

So looking into things like Cal Lighting’s SolarXtreme 1000. If you’re trying to grow profitably or are on a power budget I appreciate the need to be a hawk on costs. But I don’t sell. It is simply a great hobby. Couple of us work together and keep our family and friends supplied with what they want. It’s more about getting the best results I can get without being a complete idiot concerning costs.

| Bonjoyle
February 3 |

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Most definitely on the Samsungs. And inferior does not mean bad, just not superior. Big difference in output and efficiency. As for the change from one to the other, I started with 2 TS1000’s and grew some nice bud. I have since moved to the HLG 350r and again what a difference over the Mars TS series. I have never used the FC series but I was looking at the same light you are looking at when I decided on the HLG.

Here are pics for example of what a really good light can do.
First pic is at 11 weeks using the TS1000

This pic is same age, 11 weeks with the 350r
Also the same strain and grow method.

Samsung for the win!!

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Hlg sells refurbished lights. Hlg 650r, or scorpion rspec would give you better coverage over the solarXtreme and cost less. If money is no option go on the website and check out their new lights.

Refurbished cost
Hlg 650r $650
Scorpion rspec $750
Scorpion diablo $1000

ChilLed has some nice bar style lights as well

Growcraft x6 600w

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I can verify this. I had a bad driver on one of my HLG boards. HLG sent me a replacement driver for next day delivery via Fedex. I didn’t even have to send back the bad driver. All they asked for was the driver’s serial number so they could make a claim against Meanwell for the bad driver.

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@ltcmdr, I agree with what others have commented on with regards to Mars Hydro vs HLG. If you can afford HLG then get it. I have two Mars Hydro TS 2000 and TS 3000. I just purchased a refurb Scorpion Diablo, and the development of buds is far greater.

HLG has charts you can use to dial in you grow at different phases published on their site. Plus many other resources to dial in your lighting.

Mars Hydro run hot, I had to move the drivers outside of the tent and even at that point I was not able to turn up the light high enough and keep the tent cool enough. I setup an external ac unit and I did the best I could. What I ended up with was good weed but not great weed.

I can go on with more stories but just ask yourself this question. Do you want good weed or do you want great weed?

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I’d like to thank everybody for input. I’ve got HLG Scorpion Diablo enroute. It cost a bit more but the specs/reviews back it up. After discounts and wrangling I was comfortable with where we got the price.

I’m not shilling for any particular company here. However, the comment from Midwest Guy about how they overnighted him replacement part within 24 hours got my attention. When I talked with the company, they brought up the warranty and told me this was how they operated. I loved that because light problems occur (at least in my world) at the worst possible time.

Been doing this long enough that I have a good idea of what a particular strain will produce in my current set up. Guess we’ll know in 3 or 4 months if moving up the food chain makes more flowers. One grow won’t tell the story but should give me an idea whether it was worth it. Will share any results worth sharing.

| MoFo
February 4 |

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@ltcmdr, I agree with what others have commented on with regards to Mars Hydro vs HLG. If you can afford HLG then get it. I have two Mars Hydro TS 2000 and TS 3000. I just purchased a refurb Scorpion Diablo, and the development of buds is far greater.

HLG has charts you can use to dial in you grow at different phases published on their site. Plus many other resources to dial in your lighting.

HLG Horticulture Calculators to estimate HVAC , Light intensity

Mars Hydro run hot, I had to move the drivers outside of the tent and even at that point I was not able to turn up the light high enough and keep the tent cool enough. I setup an external ac unit and I did the best I could. What I ended up with was good weed but not great weed.

I can go on with more stories but just ask yourself this question. Do you want good weed or do you want great weed?

edited to remove unauthorized link

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Great choice!! :+1:

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I have a couple 4x4s… One veg one flower.

The hlg 600Rspec for flower is awesome… In veg I use the hlg 300L Bspec.

More than enough light. You won’t be disappointed.

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Thanks for the link information.
Found them earlier, today. Back to the drawing boards, checking the math.
Love this…

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is there really any point of having a light that can reach 2,000+ PPFD? I was looking at the Scorpion Diablo which runs 2,100 and the ThinkTech Model H which I believe is 1,700. Is the extra PPFD just marketing or does it make a difference?

Both are roughly the same price with discounts.
looking to run in a 4x4

edited to remove unauthorized links

I did not realize this about the Marshydro line…what do you base this on?

I have been using Marhshydro for 3 years now and have no complaints…

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Your objective should be to meet your plants DLI requirements. The light you use depends on the total square feet of cannabis canopy you have in your grow. Larger grows will need this level of output. You also need to consider that light intensity falls of with the square of its distance to the canopy, so unless you put the light very close to your canopy, then you’re plant won’t experience those levels.

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Deceptive marketing.

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