Purpling stems & stalks, interveinal chlorosis, spotting on leaves in week 3 of veg

  • Seeds / Strains : Different issues with AK-47 & Bubblegum purchased from ILGM in mixed seed packs, 3 ½ weeks into veg.
  • Method: Soil (FFOF)
  • Vessels: small plastic pots (½ -1 gal) to start, finishing in 5 gallon fabric pots
  • Dechlorinated tap water put through a carbon filter and ph’d to 6.2 - 6.7. Only tested runoff once and it was 7.5 ph.
  • Have only done one light feeding with FF Grow Big and Big Bloom at 814 ppm. Have added light doses of silica blast and Cal-Mag a couple of times.
  • Indoor dedicated grow space is 12’x12’ spare bedroom with a 3’ X 4’ tent for veg and 5’x5’ tent for flower.
  • Light system : 2 X Grow Light Science 300 quantum board LEDs with HI-RED spectrum using 1,056 Top Bin Samsung and OSRAM LEDs hung at 20” from canopy at ~ 75% using dimmer
  • Temps; A little too high - ranging from 75 - 87 degrees
  • Humidity; A little too low 45- 50% avg.
  • Ventilation system; Have 2 in line fans I haven’t set up yet, just using a small clip fan to exhaust through a port in my 5X5 tent right now.
  • Central air and oil heat.
  • No CO2 added.

Hello hi thank you for reading this … first-time poster here, new grower (third crop), having some issues and looking for some guidance. I believe the problem is either the high heat / low RH and / or an overall nutrient deficiency.

The AK-47 has been showing signs of interveinal chlorosis for a week now, and the worst case of purpling on stems and stalk of the bunch…

The Bubblegum started having mobile issues a few days ago, yellowing leaves curling in on themselves like taco shells, downward, and feeling dry. Today she also started showing some mottled spotting on some fan leaves, and another strange white-ish mark down the center vein of one leaf.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I used plain water last time 2 days ago, and plan on waiting one more day before giving them a feeding at half of the recommended dosage suggested by FF on Grow Big and Big Bloom, full dose of Cal-Mag & Silica Blast. Also working to lower temp and increase RH. Thanks in advance for any advice!!







Welcome!

I am surprised that with FFOF you needed nutes so soon. That soil packs a lot of punch. So much in fact that I will be using FFHF going forward.

From my experience, you are correct, 87 is a little high. My plants started to show heat stress at 85. Rh may be low for that high heat.

I myself would have transplanted into 5 gallon buckets by now. It will be easier to manage watering/feeding in the 5 gallon buckets.

Are you measuring ppm at run-off? I wouldn’t be feeding until the ppm goes under 800. I shoot for a ppm run-off of 1200 - 1400.

I am unfamiliar with your light. I ran my light at about 30%, 24 inches from the tops at 3 1/2 weeks.

BTW. Are they autos or photos?

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I will 2nd everything that @NYDon said and add that 7.5 ph is WAY too high and your locking lots of nutrients like phosphorus and potassium and thats why you have purple stems.
Also you plants all look overwatered so thats going to complicate issues even more. I would transplant those asap and get you ph down around 6.5

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Thanks for your feedback! These are photoperiod.
Not sure if I do the need the nutes this soon or not, but if I do guessing it might be because I haven’t transplanted yet like you mention so with not much medium, it’s used up the nutes already? not sure.

I did measure ppm First time was Sept. 3rd, showed 788 ppm, Second and last time was Sept 11th, where I had 2 different run off trays reading at 624 ppm and 702 ppm. According to FF feeding schedule I should be feeding at 1960-2240 ppm in week 3 of veg, which is why I was planning on feeding them tomorrow. I thought I had a little more time before transplanting, but will move that up to ASAP. Also will try moving the lights up / dimming, I think the spotting that showed up today could be from light burn.

The lights are fairly new to market. Shane from MIGRO did his review on them and is a big fan, says great value for money at $420 each, and recommending 2 for a 5X5 like mine.

thanks again!

haha I love your username lol… Thanks for the feedback. My bad, I meant that I tested my run off at 7.5 ph just one time, which surprised me. All waterings have been ph’d to 6.2 - 6.7. I’d be surprised if they’re overwatered, I’ve been doing the opposite I think… aware that most noobs over feed and over water. and learning that it’s harder to correct those issues than under watering / feeding, I’ve been erring on the side of caution and taking it easy. Pots are usually light, I use a meter I stick in the soil to test for moisture and it’s usually close to dry.
But I will transplant these ASAP. Didn;t add perlite to my FFOF firs time, but going to add about 30% going into the fabric pots so I expect to need to water fairly frequently despite the larger container.

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I’ll third what @NYDon @Indicanna_Jones have both said :love_you_gesture:

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For those lights…

If that is the case with coverage and cost; you would be better off with a light like I have: HLG 600R-SPEC. It covers a similar footprint and would save you a good amount of cheddar.

But to each their own. Buy what you are comfortable with.

And like @Indicanna_Jones mentioned… you really should be at 6.5, even up to 6.8 at run-off. I struggled with that too.

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Welcome to the forum! You’ve gotten the advice I’d have given already. Make sure you have a high quality pH meter, and calibrate it often.

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Thanks for the advice! I do calibrate my PH meters and I use 2 just to make sure they’re accurate. So if I’ve been making sure my water is pH from 6.2 to 6.7 but my run off is reading as too alkaline at 7.5, do I need to ph my watering to ~ 5.5 ph?

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Try this mix put strawberry Fields on the bottom of ur pot and then mix happy frog and ocean Forest together and put it on top of the strawberry Fields thats a recipe from a you tube channel i follow

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Here’s the metrics on the lights I’m using… Overall it (allegedly) performs better than the HLG Scorpio Diablo 650, but of course I need 2 to cover the same space one of those covers, so there’s that

I am by NO means experienced enough or familiar enough with lights to dig into this and guide.

But this pro is… @dbrn32

Maybe he can help with this.

I’d say increase airflow around your plants. Cannabis can handle higher temps if you get some air to the leaves. I had all the gear but neglected to include airflow inside my tent. Kept have some of the issue that looked similar to your pics.
When I switched on my inside and exhaust fans things started liking much better.

Top tips for indoor climate control

  • If you are not able to follow a V.P.D chart, then you can use a hygrometer and be vigilant to the temperature and humidity. This device will give you an accurate reading, as well as inform you of the highest and lowest data from a 24 hour period.
  • Use a humidifier or dehumidifier in order to control the humidity levels. During the growing phase of 18/6, Cannabis plants enjoy a range from 75% down to 50% the closer you get to flowering.
  • Keep exhaust fans, oscillating fans and intake fans running 24/7. Creating a consistent environment will allow you to control the levels of stagnant air being dispersed from the tent and the air fresh.
  • Temperature fan controllers can be installed inside a grow room, and will allow the temperature and humidity to remain consistent to how the plants require. They are quite expensive, however will take your indoor growing game to the next level and will take a lot of work off your hands.
  • If you are planning to use CO2, then be prepared to take your temperature past 30 degrees Celsius, with high humidity. This can be a red flag zone for many growers, so be careful is supplementing plants with CO2.
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Sorry just reread… set up those inline fans. They use up the CO2 they need to breath quickly and the inline fans will pull new air in for them to breathe.

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If you were to acknowledge Migro test methods as sufficient, the grow light science light has "usable ppf/watt of 2.40. The Scorpion Diablo has "usable ppf/watt of 2.60. Would make the scorpion the higher performing light.

You have to watch out for comparisons with asterisks. The migro method of testing isn’t bad, and may be more useful to a lot of growers. But a small change in the situation will change the performance results. It does seem like a pretty good value though.

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What a great community you have here. Less than a day later and I’ve gotten quite a few well considered responses. I really appreciate it. Based on what I’ve heard here so far I plan to do the following :

  • Transplant to 5 gallon fabric pots
  • Install inline fans
  • Move lights from 20" to 24" from canopy
  • Calibrate PH & TDS meters
  • Slurry test medium; consider suggested changes to straight FFOF if reading at a high ph

Thank you for your insight, taking my first toke of the day in your honor :raised_hands:

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I think I would get feedings and ph lined out and they will probably be fine. Maybe look at potting up as well.

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This is way too high. I’m guessing this is your problem. Lock out

I have the whole fox farm set sitting in my garage. I use it for veggies. I have since switched to Lotus Nutrients.

Fox farm NUKED my plants. And I was only feeding at 20-40%

I could rant about fox farm, but I know a lot of people on here are very successful with them. I do however like their soils. FFOF should have 3-4 weeks of nutes available with no need to add anything.

BTW, it’s engineered well. Really no need to add perlite.

Week 3 of Veg should be a really easy week that should be exciting and nowhere near stressful. You should be killing it at this point. I’m sorry you’re having trouble this early on.

Here is what I would do if I were you. Transplant into 5 gallon fabric pots. My method would be this;
Fill the fabric pots with FFOF, add pH’d water with Recharge in it to get it moist. Make a hole in the soil and double check the depth. Sprinkle 2 tablespoons of Mykos in the hole trying to get the edges. I’d also use Azos. I’d place the plant in the hole, fill in the dead spaces and water again lightly with the recharge water. Then I would spray the leaves with Dr. Zymes, tops and bottoms.

I really think this would get them to bounce back. I find that recharge and other microbial products help to fix the problems we create for these plants.

I’d continue to water every 3-4 days or when the pot gets light with pH’d water only with added Fish Sh!t or King Crab.

I’d wait 3 weeks to start feeding the trio again, never going above 1000ppm in Veg. At that point you should be ready to flip.

Here is a better feeding schedule for FF with realistic PPM.

pH nutes to 6.6-6-9

I really broke this down. I wasn’t trying to be condescending. If it read that way, I’m sorry.

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Glancing at that schedule I should Mention that if you use those measurements your PPM will be crazy high. Try 20-40% it should get you where you need to be.

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@NeoGroR Thanks for your response, it’s very helpful. I was just at my local hydro store, the guys there are also very helpful, and they recommended much the same. Sold me on a bag of Recharge and moving them into their final containers with a mix of FFOF and Happy Frog. Note I never feed them at the high suggested range by FF, I only fed them once at 817 ppm at which point the AK-47 was already showing the Interveinal chlorosis but the problems with the bubblegum spotting and curling yellowing lower the leaves didn’t start until after that feeding. I did add half dose of the recommended on Silica Blast and Cal Mag in 2 other waterings. I’m going to take your advice use the recharge and hold off on feeding again for a few weeks. My guy at the store suggested alternating recharge and plain waterings until then, how does that sound?

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