My first grow - The Plan So Far

Lost187 · September 3, 2022, 6:26am

Alright, I’m Lost187 and this is where I’m starting off at. This is going to be a long post, hope you don’t mind
I have Gorilla Glue Feminized seeds, not Auto, from ILGM.
I have a mars hydro tent kit.
Amazon.com: MARS HYDRO Grow Tent Kit Complete 2x4ft TSL2000 LED Grow Light Dimmable Grow Tent Complete System, 24"x48"x70" Hydroponic Grow Tent 1680D Growing Tent Set Full Spectrum Grow Kit : Patio, Lawn & Garden

Some Happy Frog and Ocean Forest soil, I’ve got 4 germinated seeds in 6 oz cups of Happy Frog currently, waiting for sprouts. My plan is to transplant to a 1 gallon pot 2-3 weeks after sprouting, mixing Happy Frog and Ocean Forest soil, or Happy Frog and amendments. Transplant to a 3 gallon pot probably 5-6 weeks, once again mixing soils/amendments. I have 5 gallon grow bags for the final transplant from the tent kit, but I’m questioning whether I should get larger bags. Either way, there will be a final transplant with either an Ocean Forest heavy or full Ocean Forest addition with a final round of amendments.

My first big question involves when to top for scrogging. I have 4 prospects, but to keep this grow coherent I might cull a runt or a three branch plant as those seem to grow slower from what I hear. I’m also considering just keeping the 2 best plants at 2nd transplant and seeing if I can gift them away to interested friends, which shouldn’t be too hard So planning on 2 plants grown to maturity, I plan to train the plants using tomato twine, how many main branches should I aim for to fill a 2x4 area to best yield? Also timing, after final transplant the plants might be tall idk how fast or high Gorilla Glue grows, so should I top, wait a few days and before I start training transplant, or do you think it won’t matter? I don’t think trying to transplant into a grow bag after tying the plant to a net is a good idea, but if anyone has a good experience doing it, let me know.

My 2 second big question is how to amend the soil. I have purchased based on advice from some family that used to grow decades ago to buy these sorts of things:

Down to Earth brand:
Soybean Meal 7-1-2
Fishbone Meal 4-12-0
White Azomite Powder 0-0-0.2
Kelp Meal 1-0.1-2

Should I buy Gat Guano 7-3-1, or does the above suffice?

Wiggle Worm Worm Castings
Plantation Products Vermiculite

I realize a lot of people on here are using nutrient mixes but I’m hoping there is someone a little more old fashioned to shed some light. My plan is to mix in half the recommended amounts on the package at the 2nd transplant for everything above essentially, with the exception of the Vermiculite. It seems like everyone is saying Perlite for drainage is the way to go so I might not worry about the Vermiculite.
And note to self, go buy Perlite.
For the final transplant I’m debating mixing the additives full strength or half strength, and probably cutting out the soybean meal as the fresh soil and fish bone meal should be sufficient for flowering. Any advice on that point, and full Ocean Forest vs mix is helpful.

I’ve heard people talk about mykos or the actual name I can’t spell, but both Happy Frog and Ocean Forest include it, so is it worth picking up and adding another source of it as I’ve heard it mentioned. Same thing for Bat Guano, so should I worry about including more?

Then finally, if my plants survive this intensive trial by fire / learning experience, I do have the TSL 2000 from Mars Hydro, and there have been mixed reviews from people on here about their quality, but I suspect the light will at least be good enough for veg. I’m considering picking up an HLG 30 UVA XL supplement to hang along side the TSL 2000 for flowering. Any thoughts on that idea or alternatives?

I realize I’m throwing a lot out here, any and all comments are welcome, and Thanks!

anon1893985 · September 3, 2022, 9:32am

Very nice setup… just a suggestion but i transplant on day 14 from a seedling grow pot into their forever home… at day 14 the roots are very healthy and have filled up most all of the pot and take off once transplanted… gl

TransplantedFarmgirl · September 3, 2022, 9:09pm

Welcome to the community @Lost187 It sounds like a great grow! Here are the highlights I can help with:

@AfgVet is a great grower to discuss taming the grow with manual techniques like scrog. She has great journals outlining the grows and methods, very much worth a trip over and check out her topics.
A 2x4 grow area is gonna get pretty full with the plan listed. Those 5 gal will probably fill the space quickly. Many of us growers who use soil do appreciate Happy Frog for starting, and adding Ocean Forest later in the grow, about the time the transplant for flowering would occur. Some put the seedlings in their final pots (pretty close to two weeks of veg in my experiences) and some graduate their plants to bigger pots and more assertive grow mediums (Ocean Forest burns seedlings and early clones…ask me how I know! ) There are benefits for each method, and both have their merits.
Mycorrhizae is something I always add to my medium, even with something like Happy Frog that already has it, I still do. My root systems when I chop the plant can be almost as long as the plant is tall. It helps support good growth above to have healthy growth below, it is worth the investment, in my opinion.
I have done a guerrila grow in the backyard that I used all organic stuff (no piped in water or added ‘fancy’ nutes, just bonemeal/bloodmeal and epsom salt in the hole with compost) and the plant did great. Did it do as well as a constantly maintained, perfectly trimmed indoor grow with everything controlled? Nope. Was it still good? Yep. Honestly though, if you are using Happy Frog, transplant into a mix of HF/OF for flowering, you would only be worried about 4 weeks of flowering time where the nutes would be added. I also used shooting powder for the last five weeks, a lot of phos to help with flowers getting bigger.

I have learned a lot on my grows, something different for each, and can tell you I have learned a lot mroe from my failures than successes, so dont be upset if something goes awry, we can help and you’ll learn more than you expected!
Good luck!!

Graysin · September 3, 2022, 9:49pm

I agree here and scrolled to say this. The best I would I would expect is 4 really cramped plants in a 2x4 or 2 very large plants. In a 5gal pot, I got 4 in a 4x4.

Lost187 · September 3, 2022, 11:33pm

Right on, thanks for responses, especially you, transplantedfarmgirl! I’m pretty sure I’ll end up with 2 large plants which is why i wanted to transplant a couple times. With some growth, i think i can bury the main trunk later in the grow in a bit and hopefully save space in that tent.

I turned the light on to see how hot it would get and came back to it being 88 degrees with a fan running! So now I’m trying to figure out how to mount the light power bricks outside the tent. Or possibly to the rear upright posts and up near the top vent. Thankfully nothing has sprouted yet and the pots are still moist so I’m pretty sure i didn’t kill anything yet.

Storm · September 4, 2022, 12:08am

Welcome to the forum.

Blastfact · September 4, 2022, 4:07pm

Your needlessly over complicating. I would not do all that transplanting. Go from the solo cups straight into the 5 gal bags. No need for 1 gal and 3 gal transplants. Your 2 x 4 will do pretty good with 3 GG4’s. Two would be ideal with a extended veg for some nice heady bud. Two plants will leave you good working room and the ability to put a small humidifier or dehumidifier in the tent if need be and control with a Ink Bird. If your going to go organic I would go simple and use only Gaia Green or Earth Dust Worm Castings and Epson Salt when needed. Put your popped seeds in solo cups with holes for drainage in the Ocean Forrest. Ocean Forrest has everything they need for 2 or 3 weeks. Mix up your organic soil with Happy Frog, get it in the 5 gal pots, wet it down and get it to cooking. It takes a couple of weeks to get your soil going. Also use a solo cup to make a perfect transplant hole for the all important super easy to do transplant. If you have wetted your soil down for the organic cook/start and kept it damp transplant will be painless and there will be plenty of moisture in the soil for transplant. Only water your seedlings 1 oz. or 2 oz. of water at a time. Do not drown them and I also ph my water I do not trust even a true organic grow to control ph. Your two biggest problems will be to not drown your seedlings and to not fiddle dick around with stuff. Water properly and set on your hands… Good Luck!

Docnraq · September 4, 2022, 4:31pm

Id start in HF then move to OF then when flower hits move to SF. All 3 I would cut with 20-25% med size perlite. HF is lighter on Nitrogen then OF so good way to start seeds, nitrogen needed more in veg so OF over HF. SF has less N and more P and K perfect for flowering.

In a 2x4 5 gal would be where I would stop.

If transplanting often, less will be more as far as ammendments go. Fresh FF soil highly nuted straight outta bag. If staying in same pot entire grow, more amendments will be needed.

It will matter, transplanting and HST methods like topping can be very stressful. Leave 3-5 days between any action like those, IMO.

When repoting in fresh soil so much addtl nute wont be required. Each repot should give you a couple to a few weeks of nutes.

Vermiculite is inert so it wont add nutritional value to your soil, it will however increase water retention, I cant see a reason to use it in FF soil, especially in SF.

This is not accurate. OF does not include Mycorhyzae. You should get some, I like great white shark and am currently testing Extreme Gardenings Myco and AZO. If you go with GWS, get a bacteria also, I hear Tribus is a great product.

The TS and E models from MH use lower tier diodes they are just good lights. The FC and SP models from MH use samsung lm301B diodes and Meanwell Drivers. These are very good lights. If going MH in a 2x4 Id get an sp3000 or higher. HLG are top tier lights with a top tier pricetag.

Lost187 · September 6, 2022, 2:49am

Wow! Thank you both for the detailed suggestions! @Blastfact i do have a habit of overcomplicating things lol, but sometimes that’s half the fun. I will cut out the 1 gal transplant, that does seem overkill for what I’m doing but i do what 1 transplant to let them grow before i top and I’m worried the cups they’re in won’t be sufficient for long. I also didn’t realize an organic soil mix would need time to get going, thank you for letting me know, I’ll get that started tomorrow.

@Docnraq thank you for breaking down your advice so thoroughly, i did some looking and everywhere in my area that carries foxfarm soils doesn’t carry any strawberry fields, although i did find the extreme mycos in a couple local shops. I’ll be picking that up for sure. I am looking to boost P and K with fishbone meal instead.

As it is, i have now have 3 sprouts just starting to grow. I’ll give #4 till the end of the week.

Docnraq · September 6, 2022, 3:24am

For like 8 bucks get a great sample pack

Lost187 · October 3, 2022, 3:52pm

Hey, it’s been a minute, but I’m back with updates! I did listen to you @Blastfact about about simplifying the transplanting. I layered my soil mixes, watered and let them sit in the garage to warm up, then transplanted. I still have all four, so i might let one go and grow three, haven’t decided yet.

@Docnraq thank you for the extreme gardening link!i got their starter kit and i used the mykos and azos during transplant, going to work the rest in as they grow.

Docnraq · October 4, 2022, 2:31pm

Looking good! Im using the tea that came with it today, love that sample pack! I only have a single plant going right now so I took and cut open the tea bag and myco bag weighed them on my scale and divided the whole thing by 5, since it makes about 5 gal of tea. Now I can make 5 indivdual gallons of tea.

I used a coffee filter, tied with fishing line to make a diy tea bag.

Lost187 · October 4, 2022, 3:38pm

Nice! So that tea is a powder in a tea bag essentially? Thats good to know if it is. I have a vacuum sealer that doesn’t need to run the vacuum, so I might split it up and seal a few pouches just to keep track of it. The two in the plastic pots just have a straight mix of OF and HF with some perlite thrown in so they will need some fresh food before the fabric pots do.

I’m also going to top the two in the fabric pots sometime this week, probably when they reach a foot tall, they were 9.5" and 10.25" last night. And the one in the green pot in front, that guy has been taller than the rest from day one lol.

Docnraq · October 4, 2022, 6:20pm

Yes, these are the measurements, in grams, when divided up in fiths

HeyJB · October 5, 2022, 3:03am

what I do best!

Lost187 · October 5, 2022, 3:21pm

Awesome, thanks @Docnraq, another question for you. I can get disposable tea bags off amazon, like 100s for 10 bucks with drawstrings and whatnot. Do you think a 4"x6" bag will be large enough for 1 gallon portion, or what do you think would be a good size?

I’m also going to top these ladies today, 3 of them anyway. The 2 frontrunners are growing 3/4 to a full inch a day the past 3 days and the slowpoke in back just isn’t keeping up. Slowpoke also isn’t drinking as much water as the other 3, but is otherwise equally healthy looking.

The water I’m using currently is 5-gallon bottles of Primo and ph’ed to 6.3-6.5 and my soil tester showed essentially the same for all 4 pots. I used my soil tester on samples from all 4 last night for fertility as well, and it reads in the Ideal range, but on the lower side, like a bit above the end of the Ideal box but not much. Luster Leaf 1818-6, the boxy 4-in-1 kind is my budget soil tester. I’ve read in other threads about the BlueLabs set of pens and it’s on the shopping list lol, but I’m gonna make due for now.

Docnraq · October 5, 2022, 3:56pm

I used a coffee filter, placed the compost material in the center and sinched it into a teardrop shape. It would prolly take a few tea bags but dont see any reason you couldnt use them. Its not alot of powder.

Best part about photos is that they can be topped healthy or not and you can take the time to get em to where you want them before flipping. The slow poke looks healthy AF! Since she is smaller then her sisters you intend to top, experiment with lst on her. It will give you a broader range of tactic come your next grow. Any questions about topping technique? Always good to ask prior if you do

I use primo RO water also.
Just incase…
RO and Distilled water are ph UNstable. Be sure you are adding calmag or epsom salt (300-350ppm) to stabilize the water before PHing. This will be Very important.

Those are seriously inacurate, as Im sure you read. I wouldnt trust it to test liquid. A good ph tester is the 2nd most important piece of equipment an indoor grower can have. While im sure it is nice to have a ph meter to test the soil PH you dont need to test the soil near as often as you would the water/nutrient. Bluelab has a pretty nice looking soil tester (glass tip pointy) but its almost 200 bucks for the pleasure. You can get a 80 dollar apera ph60 and do soil slurry to test soil ph saving you almost 80.00. Either are a good choice. I love my apera ph60. Until you get one or the other, you might wanna get a cheap ph meter, like the ones from High School science class. (about 12 bucks) they are a pain to calibrate and are unreliable but ment for liquid which would help to insure your feed/water ph until you can affird a more accurate one. If its gonna be more then a couple weeks before you can put together the $, I would go this route.

Lost187 · October 5, 2022, 4:12pm

Quick pic before i head off to work. My goal is even canopy height so i topped level to the slowpoke basically

Lost187 · October 6, 2022, 2:46am

M

Lost187 · October 6, 2022, 3:07am

All right, now that I’m back from work I added a few more pics off the phone. I’ve gotten used to it having grown visibly over a given 10 hours but damn!

@Docnraq Thanks, I was curious what you thought about the idea, one of my goals in any project is to try and makes things as streamlined and consistent as possible, and try to grow indoors is complicated enough that I’d rather have a plan ahead of time lol. I’ve actually spent a lot time reading other threads, especially @Hellraiser 's GG4 and other stuff thread. There was some excellent info in there about topping and a graphic someone shared showing the proper place to cut for topping. He also did pictures showing where he chose to do his topping, and I basically went over that before going to town.

I’ve also been reading @SynysterChris 's thread about "taco"ing leaves because I had one of my plants start to do that, the frontrunner in the green pot, but I think its mostly humidity because when I open the tent and humidity gets to drop it flattens out a bit.

I’m ordering that apera ph60 tonight off amazon for $80, but I’ll have it friday.