Im coming in to week 4 of flower sunday and i noticed some drooping of the leaves and certain spots of these purple Bloches im in coco/perlite 70/30 and my ppm runoff is at 840 and im feeding in at 705 to 650 i water twice a day with jacks 321 i lowered nutes at watering to 50% due to always have servere nute burn i ph water to 5.8 to 5.9 idk what else to do when i check runoff ph its in the 7.2 range but alot of things i have read claim that the runoff ph does matter any suggestions?
Wow I thought I had high ph. Also coco and Jack’s.
Are you using microbes?
What are the feed amounts per gallon or liter?
Adding any other supplement?
What water are you using? What is its pH & PPM?
I think if living soil is used pH is much less of a concern. That is not the case with Jacks and Coco.
I have had to flush and reset the coco’s pH this and in a couple earlier grows. My first grow using Jack’s and coco I ignored the pH signs because everyone said not to worry about it with Jack’s. Some said they don’t even check runoff pH any longer.
Why? What size pots are you using?
This grow I have 4 clones each in a 2 gallon rain science bag (best money I spent).
Today is day 24 since flipping. This is just before giving them their 21 defoliation
What I have been doing the last month to manage pH is give each plant 1 liter of RO water. Follow that with a Jack’s feed pHd to 5.7 sometimes 5.6 and ppms around 1000 of 2 liters each. I add silica, bud candy, and nirvana ( the last two at 50%) and tribus once a week. This has kept runoff pH at 6.1 - 6.2 and ppms 900 to 1100.
@beardless i use tps billions microbes every watering and im in 5 gal fabric pot. I water twice a day because of how fast my coco dries from the plant drinking water. I feed 1 gal each to runoff of about 25% to handle the ppm readings in each feed
@beardless im stilling waiting to purchase a RO machine but im been using filtered water because of my well ph being to high like 8.9 to 9.0 ph out of my tap water on well
Even being in only 2 gallon pots and this far long in flower I have not found it unnecessary to water more than once a day. If I give 3L per day per plant that is around 39% by volume. Giving 2 gallons per 5 gallon pot is 40%. We are at about the same place.
This time of year, summer, I have several dehumidifiers running so I have an endless supply of zero ppm water. My tap water is around 7.4 - 7.6 and 180 ppm. I mix the two usually in a 50/50 mix. I like the extra Ca and Mg from my well.
I think the action of the microbes significantly modifies the root level ph. That is it raises it. I have no idea of how that happens but I have no other plausible explanation. I once thought it was the Ca in my well water, this may in part contribute to the elevated pH, but does not explain it entirely. My plants are happy if I keep the pH around 6.2
Watering twice a day during the transition is not uncommon. Runoff numbers are not bad. When I grew in coco, I watered once a day. I went through a period of wasting gals of water trying to get the pH runoff to cooperate, then found out later that there is too much stuff in the perlite that causes pH to fluctuate during flushes. Numbers will jump around like crazy.
IMO, don’t get caught up in trying to get pH runoff numbers right. As long as ppm levels and pH numbers going in are good, then all you need to do is be concerned about ppm runoff numbers. They will tell you how much she is eating.
Also, IMO, she looks over watered. After transition, 3-5 weeks, they may have a tendency to slow down eating. So, therefore you may not have to water as often. The plant will discard leaves when it feels the need to say, maybe needs air in a certain part of the plant or, when it’s just done with that leaf.
Using Jacks, it’s not uncommon at all to go through a whole grow with just about always having a little nute burn leaves as well as a touch of nitro toxicity in leaves. It has yet to stop any of my plants from growing.
If they continue to droop, I would say slack off the watering. If your ppm runoff numbers start to climb then I would consider water/feed schedule.
Your plants are looking great! Good luck and keep’em growin!
@beardless what is your feed are you feeding full strength 321 or are you like me and dialed back some and i thought you couldnt over water coco or it was pretty fucking hard to do so
It is hard to over water in coco but you still have to listen to the plants so to speak. If you had small pot then I would say yes to watering twice a day but 5 gal pot is plenty big enough to retain the water for the size plants you have… this is just my opinion.
Another option for you to look into maybe is Jack’s for Tap. It’s supposed to help with high ppm and pH water out of the tap. There are folks here that use Jacks for Tap even though they have good water quality and it’s working great for them.
Your doing great just keep’em growin!
I am using what I call Jack’s Hybrid
It is in between the conventional 321 formula and the Jack’s nutrients published rates. I do all of my measures in liters because that is what advanced nutrients uses.
This is my schedule of recent mixes and its unadjusted pH / ppm
In this schedule I document how much I dilute the mix and adjust pH
This a portion of my grow journal. This where I track ph & ppm of what goes in and the related runoff numbers along with general notations.
Can you tell I am a numbers guy by occupation
Yes i can because im over here confused already and i also lied to you i thought it was in a 5 gal no that is a 3 gallon do you think i need to up pot? To a 5 gal or is it to late or is it okay just to watar once a day still? @beardless
@beardless if i feed full strength im afraid its going to go back into nute lockout again and your charts are crazy specific do you have any pics of your cured bud? After trim?
@beardless also my well water has a ph of around 8.8 with 110 to 150 ppm if i was to purchase i ro system i know it would decrease ppm but what about ph would it bring it down to 5.0 or 6.0 or would it carry the ph moving through the system and not change at all? Ive been using filtered water and everything has been going fine but kinda of tired exchanging 5 gal bottles of water lol
In a sense RO and distilled or dehumidified water does not have a pH. I believe technically it is 7.0 neutral. However as soon as it is exposed to the environment (air) it changes.
up-potting is not necessary. Coco can accommodate smaller pots because of frequent fertigation.
It really depends on the plants consumption, temp and humidity. Hotter drier will cause the plant to consume more. And of course a larger plant will need more than a smaller plant. Lifting the pot is a good way to confirm if it needs to be watered.
This a GDP bud that has been dried and most of its leaves removed.
After I cut the bud from its stem I go over it one more time. A canna brush makes fast work of this.
A few more.
Once broke down and cleaned up, into the Grove bags to cure.
Backing up 10 days, hanging in the tent drying
I am currently growing out clones taken from this plant. Four of them are pictured in an earlier post. Two more in autopots in the closet
@beardless in your personally opinion would it benefit me to purchase a ro system? If my ph is 8.8 and ppm stay around 110-150?
PPM of 110 - 150 is really pretty decent. So no I do not think it is necessary. The major reason for using RO is its ppm is low which in turn allows for more nutrients. I wonder what is in it to raise its pH so much.
Its getting a letting worse?
I watered at 814 ppm and 820 came back out
Water ph going in was 6.05 only watered once tonight i still feel like i should be watering twice a day due to it only being a 3 gal pot and it took a
1 gal and 1/4 qt of water to achevie 20% runoff
I am not opposed to 2x watering a day. I first give each plant 1 liter of RO / distilled water and then follow this with 2 liters of Jack’s. This method has maintained pH and runoff PPM. The question I ask myself is; can I skip the RO water only and give a reduces potency of Jacks using the same amount of water and receive the same results? I tried this method prior to using the one I use now. For some reason it was not as effective. Why the results are different I do not know.
Regarding leaves - it takes a while for any changes to take effect. If the pictured leaves were already showing deficiencies, continued degradation is expected. What you look for is new leaves not being affected.
@beardless @HappyHydroGrower i noticed when watering i had these like white bugs jumping and crawling around in my coco i added diatomaceous earth to try and control the infestation i put some potato slices as well to see if they would attack it and they did have ither one of you know how to prevent it with watering everyday because i didnt water yesterday and today they were limped leafs. Is there another alternative because i also read to much DE turns medium into a rock