Feeding/using fertilizer on seedlings


#61

p.s. The 2 were not root bound at all when I transplanted them. I cut the peat pot away on one, and did not see any more roots really, except for the couple i knew were stickin out the bottom of the peat pot already… Same with the bottom of the other bigger one i transplanted…


#62

I just read this article on dolomite lime online some place called Organica or something like that… Now I am really confused… lol

Can not seem to upload it tho…https://organicagardensupply.com/ph/dolmite-lime-more-harm-than-good/

Sorry, it does not seem to work, but i am terrible with computers… Can’t even seem to make my new digital timer to work either… Thought i did it right, woke up, and it did not work…!!! Arrrggggg!

Anyway, u can goggle, “dolomite lime more harm than good”, if u r interested in what this person wrote… I found it very interesting, but confusing…!!! Looks like they sell various products tho…, and dolomite lime is not one of them, I assume!!!

I used dolomite lime years ago, to try to fix messed up soil before planting/landscaping for a new house… Experts at the university told me to use lots and lots of dolomite lime to try to get the ph better, before planting, and lots of fertilizer too, of course… I think the soil was too acidic…??? Very long time ago… lol Dolomite does lower ph… I believe… Over time anyway. Might take awhile. Wonder how long it takes to change ph of soil…??? Anyway that article says dolomite has too much Cal…, or is it too much Mag… I think they said too much Cal…


#63

I think one can buy “fast acting dolomite lime”… Thanks again for the help @DTOM420!!!


#64

Lime RAISES pH. Since many FF soils I’ve used we’re on the acidic side, adding lime is helpful. If you have soil that’s neutral (7) or higher, you don’t want to add lime unless you’re adding another acidic component to balance it out. My advice- take a recipe that’s known to be good and follow it. As you dig deeper and get a good understanding of how the soil works and how each amendments works and effects the soil, you can tweak things. Don’t try and master it all at once.

Also, I wouldn’t try mixing a soil that will take you from seedling to harvest - you’re gonna have to feed your plants along the way. Find a good feeding system to try and then use it all the way through a grow. If you have issues, post pix and get recommendations. On what to feed (or not) to fix it. Keep it simple. Don’t bite off too much at once. Relax and enjoy the growing experience. :wink:


#65

Sometimes it does. I bought 15 bags of FFOF recently and it tested 5.5-5.7 I still like it but I’m cutting it with other things now and I water with higher pH water from my well to compensate.

Glad your plants aren’t rootbound. It’s hard to diagnose without pix and details. Perhaps you water’s pH is off? If you have nutrient lockout or even very acidic or alkaline water, it can stunt some plants that are sensitive. Is there a lot of chlorine in your water or do you filter it. SO many reasons your plants could be stunted. It’s very hard to know without every detail of what you did; and sometimes even knowing all that won’t produce an answer.

I water seedlings with distilled water only until they have 3-4 sets of true leaves.


#66

I forgot to answer your question about how I got the branching. I don’t top or fim my autos. It’s possible but needs to be done at very specific times so as not to stunt an auto. I DO top and fim my photos. I use Low Stress Training (LST) to get branching. I wish I could link directly to a couple articles in the training and techniques, outdoor growing and indoor growing forums over on Autoflower.net but I’m not sure that’s allowed. There are loads of YouTube videos on it.

Basically I bend the plants at 45°-55° while supporting the base of the stem with a stake and/or tie and I tie them over with rubber covered wire. This encourages your lower branches to grow. Even if you dont see them, they’ll grow from each internode. As soon as they are just long enough to begin bending, start laying them over and tying them so that they grow outward. Try and plan it out so that you end up manipulating some in every direction of your pot. Don’t ever let any branches get as tall as the top of your main stem/cola. This is key! There is a hormone called Auxin that encourages growth to the highest part of the plant. Bending the main stem over interrupts the primary effort from the main cola to the lower branches which compete to become dominant. Autos are very sensitive to stress so high stress methods like manifolding and supercropping will hurt yields. So, LSTing is the way to go. Hopefully I’m explaining this well enough.

Here are a couple of good articles that illustrate how to do it. I figured it out from seeing articles like them.

Hope this helps!


#67

Autoflowers can get stunted if the roots are disturbed, including overwatering & transplanting; if you use high stress training at the wrong time; if you overfeed; if you do anything that takes time for your plant to recover.

Autos are on a strict time line which the grower has absolutely no control over. They are going to grow, bloom, and be ready for harvest at a certain time, no matter what you do. So, if you do anything that requires time for your plant to recover from, you can cause severe stunting.

Of course, you might not have any issues, but the potential is there with autoflowers.


#68

Ah, nuts!!! Let me see if I can find the chart someone sent me weeks ago!!! lol Raises or lowers… I only know acidic and alkaline…!!! Well, I thought I did!!! Let try to find that chart!!! Never looked at it from the point of a chart… before. Just thought that Lime makes soil more alkaline!!! And less acidic!!! And that too acidic sucks, for many kinda of plants such as grass…, real grass, like the lawn I was planting for the new house…, but some plants like acidic soil to some extent, but not pot!!! lol Let me try to find that dang chart, and see if I can put it on here… lol Thanks u guys!!! lol


#69

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#70

Ok… I had the chart backwards… I, for some reason, assumed that acidic was at the top, and alkaline was at the bottom, with out really looking at that part… Was just looking at what I should be at more, I guess… 6.5 or so being the goal, according to the chart, and what I was told… Which is one part that I did have right, I think…!?! lol

Therefore, If FFOF is more acidic, (this chart says that is lower), than what they claim… That surely does not seem good at all!!!

Which means… My water…, which is spring water, is more alkaline than the chart says is optimum My water, whether I get it right from the spring, or the tap, is 7 point something, mid seven’s or so I guess… And I have been adjusting it down to around 6.5 or so…, but if my soil is more acidic than I thought, then… I think I have been adjusting my water to be LOWER, than I should be doing… lol for one thing… lol


#71

Yep, they’re very sensitive ladies. No doubt! So you have to be gentle about the LST. I started mine (aside from leaf tucking) once they are at about the 6th-7th node and about a foot tall. I only lean them to 45° and you kinda have to ‘feel’ what they’ll take. Meaning, if they’re really resistant, just go a little and do some more a few days later. Every highly successful auto grower I’ve met uses LST. A surprising number actually do some topping also but they’re pretty reluctant to recommend it to others because the timing has to be spot-on. I’m nowhere near knowledgeable enough to do that. Yet, anyway. The plants I’ve LST’d have responded and far outgrown the ones I didn’t. So, now, I’m doing ALL of my autos.

Sure, anybody can pop a ton of seeds and grow them in a SCROG and getva pretty grow with lots of buds but that’s a LOT of money in seeds to fill a 4x4 or 5x5 tent. I can’t afford that. Not when a little training can double or even triple my yield over just letting them grow au’natural. Lol. I’m pretty sure the “max yields” that are published by breeders are only attainable using some LST. The only two breeders I’ve actually been fortunate enough to correspond with directly have both encouraged gentle LST of their strains. The big problem is that too many people try treating their autos like photos and when that doesn’t work they pull ALL the way back, in paranoia and claim autos are too sensitive to undergo anything - which isn’t true.

Hanging out with a bunch of folks that are obsessed with autos and have done years of envelope pushing to see what works and what doesn’t has been eye-opening. There was just a grow battle where growers were tasked with the challenge of growing autos in 1 gallon/3L soda pop bottles and you should see what was grown! It was amazing what they achieved using LST and various defoliating and lolipopping our ofvthose little containers. I’m surprised there’s not more crossover between this forum and AFN - I think they’re the 2 best canna forums around with the friendliest and most knowledgeable, helpful members.

Did you see that “instatransplant” method I mentioned? It’s what I use to move up in container size from my seedling pots. It’s a zero stress system that only really works for autos. I love it because I can germ more plants for outside under a light indoors - how I like to start my outdoor plants of either type.


#72

Thanks for the vids and articles @DTOM420!!! I looked at a couple… I am really tired now… but…

Well, my bigger Auto’s are at about 4 nodes or so really… Little tiny, leaves of 5th node maybe… There are no branches starting yet really, just a little tiny bit maybe, at most… Is that too early to start LST? U mean u bend over the main stalk in the beginning? That would let light into where the branches will hopefully come from… lol Well, on one side of the plant it would… lol


#73

@DTOM420, 5.5 to 5.7 ph!!! What the Heck is going on with FF…!!! Please insert real swear words where ever it seems like I would be saying them in person, or if I thought I was allowed to write the words I am really thinking on this site!!! That is really screwed up!!! Waaaaaayyyyyyy too acidic for potting soil that is made for pot, and is supposed to be 6.3 to 6.8 ph!!! Freakin Liars!!!..!!! Means I should be watering with 7.5 to 7.7 or so water!!! 5.5 to 5.7 ph is too acidic to get any Cal. or Mag…!!! And P. too!!! According to that chart…!!!


#74

You can. Just be gentle. Don’t go too far. It’s better to do a little I’ve several days than to do too much at one time and break something. I always support the main stem right where it emerges from the soil. That way I’m not putting any pressure on the roots when I push the upper part of the plant over. I think you’ll see similar in one of those articles.

Thankfully, soil will buffer pH issues somewhat but you have the right idea. I feed and water my girls with water ranging from 6.3 - 7. It works for me and ensures that they have access to all the nutes they need. Watch your plants and they’ll tell you what they need. And GET A CAMERA! Lol! It’s indispensible these days. Your phone doesn’t have a camera? That’s what I use


#75

Sorry @DTOM420, I do not have a smart phone…, so i can not send pics to this site or any site from my phone. Have a computer cam., but it will not work… Can not afford to get a smart phone! Long story, but I am way over budget on this growin pot thing! Spent money that I should not have spent…!!! Hoping it will pay off, some day soon. Maybe next crop will be better!!! Better be!!! I will figure out how to do these new fangled ways of growin very soon! I have to now!!! lol This crop is not really important now…, will not have any yield. I can just use these three plants for practice, until I get my new light in less than a week. Next crop should go much better!!! I hope!!! lol Thanks for all the advice and help everyone on here has given me!!!


#76

@DTOM420, If one was to just use FFOF in their bigger pots for instance… Just for example…, and FFOF ph is 5.5 to 5.7…, and It really seems to me that the best ph for pot is around 6.6 or so? Right? So all the most important nutes are available, readily available? Not 6.3 or 6.4 or even 6.5 really? If that chart that i put on here recently is correct…? Then should’nt the water be more like 7.7 or so, to average out at about 6.6??? In this example??? Well, looking at that chart again, I am not sure what the orange and light blue nutrients are, and how important they are… I know that P is really important, and Cal and Mag are important too…? If the nutrient P is not available, that would be really bad? Right?

I am really surprised that FFOF tests out that low!!! Seems like what they are saying about their product is not true!!!


#77

I’m not slamming FoxFarm. Let me make that clear. I use their products and have had generally good luck with it, as have many people. However, as I got my hands on meters and testing supplies and got more interested in understanding more of what’s going on with the plants, I started hearing that there were some quality control issues that some growers were finding. Including some growers that I have enormous respect for. I figured they just got unlucky because I’d had such great luck with it in my non-canna gardens growing veggies, bushes and flowering plants. Then, I got this last big batch to help start a big outdoor canna garden and I actually tested it right out of the bag. I got a real surprise. It’s really not a big problem - it’s just something I need to be aware of so I can adjust for it. The meters are convenient but you can get a pH test kit that you just collect a small vial of water in a vial, put in a few drops of solution and match the color to read the pH. I’d definitely get one if you don’t have it already. Google how to do a slurry test, water your plants with what you’re watering with currently and see where your slurry is for your current soil. Then, if you need to adjust your water you’ll know which way to go to get it into an acceptable range.

All the nutrients are important. Even the minor ones. To make sure mine get the full spectrum, I’ll adjust my water to 6.3 on one day and the next time I may go to 6.7. But in the end, with soil, you’ll want to check your slurry’s ph - that’s whats important - what’s happening in the soil and what the roots are experiencing. Just because you pour 6.5 onto your medium doesn’t, necessarily, mean the roots are experiencing 6.5.


#78

If my soil is at 5.5 ph, and my water is 6.5 ph, then I assume my roots would be experiencing about 6.0 ph…, soon after I water… Right? then I would assume the ph would be lowering as the soil drys out… Right?

Or maybe u r saying that is not how it works?


#79

looked at those LST vids, and articles… Makes a lot of sense. Tried it on one plant so far… Will see what happens! Thanks @DTOM420!


#80

You bet! I have 2 auto plants that are in dire need of some training - I really dropped the ball with them. If I get a chance to do it tomorrow I thought I’d try to video it and post it on Vimeo just so you can see how I am doing it on my autos. If I do it, I’ll let you know.