First grow, first post


#805

You seemed to be cruising right along until you added the panels. Is there that big of a difference in felt temps from your old lights to the cobs? I never got into and of th bigger led panels. With the smaller ones, it’s noticeable but I wouldn’t say a lot.

Did you come up with a plan to mix some outside air into your intake?


#806

Definitely don’t sweet it bro in fact i light bleeched my gold leaf last run was dealing with my mother and forgot to raise the lights when i got home damage was done
Youll be fine the damaged leaves wont recover but the plant will finish off
At least you caught it brother
Woohoo


#807

@dbrn32 when I added the two additional panels for lighting it made a huge difference. I was cruising along with a balmy 75°-85° during the day. 60° at night. Those panels put out a lot of heat. That’s what caused the heating issues. I have the Rapid LED fixture turned all they up now, and it’s still about the same temperatures. I have a plan, and ductwork will be installed as soon as the fan gets here. I have to do it manually, to how much inside/outside air will get exchanged until I can order a damper. (None in town) I will be able to at least manage the additional heat. Pretty sure the one good fixture that didn’t get any burned out, will end up on e of bay. I’m thinking this will be the last grow with these fixtures. On to better lighting.
@Countryboyjvd1971 I bleached some leaves once before, I know they won’t recover, but at least there’s time for recovery. Since I just switched the light schedule.


#808

@GrinKnight led is the efficient. I was saying LEC. It’s a fuller spectrum than HID/HPS that you have coming.


#809

@Screwauger @BIGE @dbrn32 @Countryboyjvd1971 So as you can see, she’s crispy. With new growth already started. This was directly underneath one of the Cree’s at 18”. There’s one other that wasn’t as sensitive to the heat, but the same height and it also got bleached. So I’m conclusion 18” is too close with Cree COB’s. (Bad***ery if you ask me) they’ll recover just fine and I should have been more careful with the new light. I lowered it, and turned it up. Two oopsies. The way I see it, now we KNOW. Take it in stride gentlemen. But here’s the tent temps since I’ve turned the other lights off. The last 110° spike is early in the morning for about an hour they were on, and I turned them off. Then temps went down. But As you can see, very comfortable in there afterwards. Efficiency is where I love to be. (So do my plants)


#810

I’ve never ran them at over 1400ma, but had no issues other than heavy feeding at 12-14” with the 50 watters. Also literally just left a grow with 4 75 watt vero se’s And measured them at 16” without any issues yet. So I suspect some of that could be from having a little more output at 1750ma, but you could be dealing with some strains that are just a little more light sensitive too.

At any rate, it’s a great feeling to know you have as much or more energy that they can take, isn’t it? Also probably a good thing you’re not running those reflectors lol. That would boost your light intensity quite a bit.


#811

@dbrn32 yes, having extra is a great feeling, I almost don’t know what to do with it… oh wait, buy more!
It’s literally one phenotype that was sensitive to that much light intensity. At least that much with such a drastic reaction. Being clones, there’s another clone from the same mother had the same reaction and also was directly beneath the COB. I’ll say clones are handy for this reason of experiments.
This incident has me second guessing the quantum board install. I also didn’t turn the fixture back down, I only raised it up. So if I do install the boards, I can just turn the power down to save but still have enormous amounts of light.


#812

It’s very difficult for people to leave the general thought of Watts per foot when running the higher end cobs. You really have to see them in action first hand to believe it. Like where you’re at, you need more coverage not necessarily more power. If you remember back to when you ordered and got the bigger drivers, I’m pretty sure I put it out that they wouldn’t be necessary. Running at 50 Watts you could just drop them a little if need be. But it wasn’t a large expense either, so whatever right. You may be better off trying to do something like some bars of 30-50 watt cobs on those heatsinks you salvaged cost wise as opposed to the qb’s. I don’t know, you have a good base so that leaves a ton of options. You can spend your money however you’d like obviously. But you don’t need four qb’s at max current, that’s for sure.

And unless that pheno is the absolute best smoke, I’d ditch her like a bad prom date.


#813

Hahaha @dbrn32 well it’s the last time it’ll be grown. It’s the Girl Scout Cookies, and Mrs covertgrower loves it, and I have about 8 more in there. So any I can get from is a good thing. But I’ll stick to ILGM seedstock. This is a seed supreme special, and most weren’t bad.

Lighting, I understand what you’re saying. I don’t feel comfortable enough using the heat sinks I salvaged as main lighting. I’m concerned the sink won’t be large enough for cooling. There are some larger ones that might be good enough. I feel confident enough to use those as veg lighting in a second tent I’ll set up eventually. I can turn them down and I’ll order some 4K for that. I really want to try the QB in between the COB’s and it’ll provide the additional coverage. If I don’t like it or it doesn’t work, I can take the out and move them. I’m investing on efficiency and enough lighting with an ever expanding grow space. The Rapid kit is a good starting kit, with proper sized heat sinks, that works. I’ll be getting a second one so I can move the first fixture over, and the whole tent will be covered. Exhaust fan is in Anchorage, so I might get it tomorrow.


#814

Sweet! Hopefully the fan does everything you need it to. So you’re looking at adding qb’s and another rapid kit to your tent?


#815

Yes, I’ll be adding another rapid kit, and duplicate the QB’s on the new side as well. I really love the Rapid kit for the efficiency and the lumens it really cranks out. That should complete my lighting for a little while. Until something else comes out better. Then I’ll upgrade. I’ll just need additional lighting for the new 4X3 tent I’ll be adding eventually. Designated veg tent. So we can go more blue spectrum in there. @dbrn32
I hope the fan is efficient, and moves enough air. Going to set it up as a natural convection to help with the heat. So the fan won’t have to work as hard.


#817

You’ll be lighting way beyond the scope of what you can produce with. Probably creating a load issue with all the drivers as well. I thought when you were talking about putting the qb’s in it was instead of another rapid fixture. Then you would kick a bar of cobs to each end of the 4x8 and put the third one in the middle after that two qb’s between each row of cobs. You figure with that kind of setup even running the cobs at 50 watts and the qb’s at 120 Watts will probably be pushing saturation levels. Even adding a co2 burner doesn’t make them infinite. You’re talking about going from the 1000-1200umol range to maybe like 1500 umol range. And then you’re looking at having to run a sealed room and back to fighting temp issues.

When you look st having 24 cobs and 8 qb’s I’m a 4x8, I’m not even sure if adding the reflectors and dropping cobs down to like 30 Watts and qb’s to like 50 Watts makes sense there. They get so efficient at those levels it’s still a butt load of light. You know I’m a proponent of efficiency gains, but that scenario you’re talking about having around $4000 wrapped up in lights when you can only use about $2000-$2500 of it. Then you’ll need to reconfigure your drivers so you don’t need 3-4 circuits just for lighting.

Just my thoughts. If you want to go over the top for efficiency we can figure out how to do more, but you don’t want to just be throwing money out the window either.


#818

@dbrn32 that’s where I would like to be. Running close to having too much light. I know that seems extreme, but if it doesn’t work, I already have lighting for another tent. I’m going to get the heat issues as well as the cold issues dialed in those won’t be a problem anymore. I’m adding a thermostat for the intake as well. As for the recycling of air in winter time I’m certain the boiler produces enough co2 on its own with out having to supplement. Maybe a co2 ppm meter would be a good thing to consider. All of what you stated where excellent valid points and I respect what you have to say. I could be all wrong about this, but consider how many lumens for lack of a better term, the sun puts out. I’m competing with that. I know my grow space is different that the growmau5 guy, but he too ran QB and COB’s next to one another. I’m hoping eventually I’ll become a better grower and I’ll maximize my usage of light. Even if I remove some and put some in another tent. I also realize I may have to run another circuit. No problem as I ran the first one out there. I want to grow the best I can, and I’ll probably throw some vegetables in there eventually. Plans can change, and maybe I’ll find just the cob kit grows adequately enough. Either way, thanks for bringing those points up, and I’ll definitely consider those going forward. Nothing worse than throwing away money.


#819

I’m following, and agree. No issue at all with running qb and cobs together. Exactly what the parts sitting on my bench for last 6 months have been intended to do. And I’m definitely a fan of meeting or even slightly exceeding what you need. I haven’t broken down the numbers yet, but I’m guessing 12 cobs and 8 120 watt qbs will put you at the exceed amount is what I’m saying. Or, 24 cobs alone will do it too. You’re not even running reflectors and can’t get inside of 18” with 12 cobs. Maybe the other phenos will take more, and temps certainly play into that. But how much more do you think the plants will handle? Like I said in post earlier, you’re lacking coverage not density. That’s simply because there’s no way to get even coverage at any usable level from 12 cobs on 32 square feet.

When you look at growmau5 quantum canopy, look at how he used the cobs. Pretty sure he used them to cover the the downfall of the qb’s… corners and edges right? I don’t have any idea what his coverage area was either. But I’m absolutely sure between the 6 qb’s and however many cobs, he didn’t setup drivers to have max output at any level. And then he also stated he never ran it at full potential. Not a coincidence I’m sure. When you look at the reality of that situation, most of that stuff was probably donated to him so even on what could be considered an unlimited budget that was pretty much over built.

When you look at what I was suggesting, it’s pretty much same thing he did. Use the cobs to cover edges of qb. Looking at it big picture. 4 qb and 12 cobs are enough for 4x8 by any standard. Probably more than most of us can use. So anything more than that is exceeding. You need to exceed by 12 cobs and 4 more qb’s? In my opinion that’s silly, and will likely just cause more problems. You’re talking like 10 drivers to make that happen, and 120 volt circuit is rated to start 2-3. When I get a minute I’ll draw out what I feel may be a couple of better options. You can take them for whatever you’d like.


#820

Ok, sorry about the hold up and future crude sketches lol. Have a lot going on. This first pic is what I pictured of the 4x8 when you started talking about incorporating the qb’s to what you have. It’s not to scale or anything, just rough idea.


#821

Here ar some ideas if you want to go over the top.


#822

For whatever reason I’m having a hard time uploading pics. But I was just trying to show some different layouts with 6-8 qb’s and the 12 cobs you have.


#823

@dbrn32 okay what your saying is making more logical than my overbuilt overkill. COB’s for in between the panels for adequate coverage. I think this is what I was thinking, and you made it work better with more adequate coverage. If done this way, I’ll still have more light than I need correct?
I do agree with growmau5 basically being an unlimited budget, and was probably free. Or at reduced cost probably.
If I have to run a 220V to run the drivers better, that can happen to. Right now I have a 20amp curcuit running everything. But there’s room in the panel.


#824

Bumping up to 220v or technically 240v nominal will open up some things for you absolutely. For one, all of the hlg drivers gain 1-3% efficiency. But depending on the exact led power levels you decide on it can also make the elg an option. They are cheaper, but I think the biggest one is 200 watts, we can get to that later. But the drivers that are recommended two per 120v circuit usually bump to three drivers per 240v circuit. So benefits all the way around by moving to higher voltage.

I definitely know what it’s like to have the money available and want to get things done lol. But outside of messing around with my stuff in the garage, I have zero first hand knowledge of how this kind of hybrid type of light will grow. So I’m going to be along for the ride with you on this one lol. What I do know, is that 4 qb’s at 110-120 Watts each and 12 cxb’s at 50 watts each in a 4x4 def reach the good enough level in a 4x4. Since you have double that, one of each still at good enough level and you have greater than 50 watt cobs so we’re already in the right direction.

You’re still going to have a ton of options to consider, but the best place for the cobs is going to be corners and edges. Where the diode count on the boards is the lowest. If we do it right, you may be even to jump on some reflectors for your cobs and run them at half power. That would give you about a 10% increase in cob efficiency alone.


#825

@dbrn32 I’m all for hybrid unknowns. There’s no reason why it wouldn’t grow well, based on the light spectrum. Between the COB’s and panels I imagine it will have great canopy penetration. I’m also not hesitant to add more specific color LED’s but we couldn’t find any UVB lighting for reasonable and we are pretty far red already.
Adding quantum panels and sticking the cobs on the sides and corners I will agree with. The panels are not so good at covering the sides and corners. I could easily remove the outside frame everything sits in to move them to the outside and stick the panels in the middle.
I could run a separate 220V/240V for any additional drivers to add. It doesn’t have to be super efficient, but I can already see gains just in the reduction of heat.
I could still add more COB’s if needed for adequate coverage. 12 spread out seems like it would work.
Your first diagram with only 4 panels was exactly what I was picturing for the 4X4 area. You’re just taking the same and spreading it out?